Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:00:34] Thank you for joining us for this episode of Off the Wall, a podcast aimed at helping founders, executives and high net worth individuals, build wealth with purpose. Today, we’re talking about a topic that many of you have probably faced at least once in your life, and that’s burnout. In a 2023 Microsoft Global survey, 48% of employees and 53% of managers reported that they experienced burnout. It’s an unfortunate reality as our lives keep getting busier and competition in the workplace grows. So how can high achievers balance achieving personal and professional goals with not feeling burned out all the time? Well, that’s what our guest today is here to talk about. We have a burnout coach here to answer that. Rachel Boehm is a behavioral change and performance coach and a psychologist focused on transforming the way we work. Through her coaching and consulting programs. She builds burnout proof leaders, burnout free organizations, and sustainable peak performers by creating conditions to thrive. So welcome, Rachel.
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:01:40] Yeah. Welcome. Thank you. Thank you.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:01:43] So I think, a lot of listeners may be familiar with or can imagine what extreme burnout feels like. But let’s rewind and see if we can prevent that. So what are some early signs of burnout that people should be aware of?
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:01:59] You know, it’s and this is where it’s sneaky because it does. I like to say it’s a slow extinguish because saying it’s a slow burn doesn’t really work with burnout. Yeah. But you’re going to look for trends. You’re going to look for shifts in mood, behavior or withdrawing from hobbies, withdrawing from people. You know, you start to have disinterest in things that you used to care about. So even the gym, like somebody used to never miss a day and suddenly they’re like, I don’t know, the last time I went, right. Just if you think about all the times you say, yes, all of those yeses are going to come with a cost and it’s just going to edge out everything else. Just ask yourself, how many days in a row or times in a row have I answered good, just busy? Or when things calmed down all or just felt like you kind of lost your mojo? You know, these are just some things to look out for. Because it’s become, to your point, so common that we think it’s normal and that adulthood should just be a never ending game of whac-a-mole. And it doesn’t have to be that way.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:03:00] Gosh, that phrase really resonates with me. That’s how I feel.
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:03:05] Not I’ve ever felt this at all myself
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:03:07] Let’s just say that. I was, I think, two months postpartum with my baby earlier this year, and I was like, we should do an episode on burnout. So that’s where yeah, I definitely feel what you’re saying. A lot. And I think a lot of people can reflect on different points in their life where that sneakiness I think the way you described it is a good way. Because everyone knows what like the extreme not sleeping or not eating or your house is a mess, you’re a mess, you know, people can imagine that. But it’s the sneaky start of it that we’re hoping we can prevent. Right.
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:03:42] Exactly. And I mean, some research shows that it’s that there’s 12 stages. And, I mean, I don’t think that because it’s such a personal experience, it can look and feel different for some people. And that’s also for managers, what’s hard to look for in teams. And so you really have to go through he’s here’s the range of things to look for. Here’s the shifts to look for. But there are stages. We do know that. And so when I’m doing a presentation, I’ll throw a picture of Dante’s Inferno up, and I just see, like, it’s like falling down Dante’s Inferno. Like when you. So I’m a business psychologist. Mine is a PhD. I’m not clinical tester for those that are curious, like the differences. So when you get to the very bottom, like you want a clinical psychologist, like you’re looking for medical intervention, right? Physical and mental health. Like, I would love to help you not get to that point or work as part of your, your team. You know, before that, there are things that we can do from a coaching perspective to help you redirect to you personally or your your team or your employees so that you don’t get to the very depths of that inferno, so to speak. But it does start with just that self-awareness.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:04:50] Yeah. So before we talk about specific steps, because I definitely want to, talk about that. Are there any outward signs of burnout that you can look for in other people, whether that is, you know, if you’re an executive and it’s members of your team or, you know, maybe it’s someone in your your family, you know, what what can things that you can look for in other people.
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:05:12] For the team, some things that you might because some things that they might not be as open, you know, but some behaviors that you could look for again, are just those shifts in behavior. So like your top performer is not the top performer anymore. That like yes, go attitude just starts to sort of like they roll in, they do their job, they come out right. You might think like, wow, I never would have thought they would be the quiet quitter, but there they are. Just getting more cynical, moodiness, like change in moods, changes in relationships, tensions. Like being shorter with employees. It can escalate to, like yelling and just being short with clients. And then that just disinterest right. So somebody that used to be really passionate about their job is just sort of phoning it in or the seems like comparatively they’re, they’re just phoning it in. Another one is like they start arriving late for work. A big shift would be they they used to be that person. You’re like, wow, I don’t know how they do it. And it turns out they really weren’t. And like, now they’re the person we are where you’re kind of looking going. They do not seem to have their, you know, stuff together. I think and I’m kind of giving like. Hopefully you catch it before that, but sometimes it really does take those big shifts before we really see it, because again, a lot of this has become so normalized. This like hustle and bustle and constant rushing and even joking right about how busy we are, like the memes on on social media, that it really just start to normalize it in our minds. And so it just makes it a little bit harder to say, wait, like, I’m doing this a lot, but it’s actually not normal. It’s common, but not normal.
David B. Armstrong, CFA [00:06:52] It’s interesting to me because I know you work with a lot of busy and overwhelmed executives and business owners, and those people obviously have a life outside of work. And then I look at it, and the reason it’s interesting is because I suppose I could be one of those people, too. So if someone is feeling overwhelmed or if I was feeling overwhelmed, but what are some specific steps that I could take or somebody could take to prevent burnout? Specific like are there some risk factors that can be identified or, things to do if you do identify yourself as having some burnout?
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:07:30] Yeah, I, I appreciate the question because well, for a number, there’s almost two parts to that answer. So the first part is just to acknowledge what you just said. Right. See a lot of high achievers. You know, I joke like there’s going to be two sides of the coin. There’s going to be typically the people that wake up and go home. I think I’ve been burnt out for like 5 or 10 years. Maybe I should do something about that. And it’s no fault of their own, right. But for everything we just talked about it. It’s kind of like, wow, I think I gained 50 pounds overnight. Like we think it just it’s we can’t it’s just hard to notice it. Right? Because we’re just constantly rushing. We’re not in tune. But then there’s going to be that side of the coin that they think they never have to worry about it because they love what they do or because they think they thrive on being busy. Right? Like the To-Do list is an Olympic sport and professional development is an Olympic sport. And so they just don’t even think of themselves as needing to do what you’re talking about. So that first part is just recognizing if you’re if you are the latter just it can happen to anyone. I know this and it can happen to me. Right. It’s so it’s just accepting that you’re but that is it could happen to anyone. And then being aware of some of those causes. And then to your point I’ll tell you the steps. So. Burnout is a shared responsibility between the organization and the individual, and there’s probably quite a few people who get really mad at me for saying that, because there’s a big push right now for for organizations to understand that they have a role to play. But I think that swinging the pendulum a little bit and what happens is when we say to the individual, it’s not your fault, it’s the organization’s fault. That can kind of put people into victim mode and make them feel like they have no actions that they can take to help themselves or get out of the situation or the organization go, well, they they they need to do something too. Right. And you can. There are things that an organization can do to not create the space for burnout. And that’s what’s been missing for a really long time. But there are things that the individual can do to build that stress resilience and to just be an advocate for themselves, to leave a situation if it comes to it. So, Dave, that brings me to kind of the core of your question, which is what are those steps? Right. It starts with self awareness, which is hard to master on our own, but it starts there. So you can notice those stress triggers, right? When am I reacting? To that overwhelm. And how can I just take a breath and respond? Like emotions last 90s unless we hold on to them. So how can I just breathe through it and then just let it go so I can just respond more thoughtfully? How can I ensure that even in those peak push times, I’m getting the sleep that I need? I’m eating the food that I should be eating, right? Those self-care routines that have become a little commercialized to the point where we seem that it feels like they’re really silly and luxurious and we need to earn them, but we don’t. Right. If you can reframe self-care as performance recovery, for example, you’ll likely feel less guilty about taking it, and it really is vital to manage your energy using those tools of sleep stress management, nutrition, exercise, movement, micro breaks. By just doing that, you’ll just put yourself in a better position.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:10:58] What is a micro break?
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:11:00] Oh, so it’s a 30 second to five minute break that you can sprinkle throughout your day. And it’s any do it. I don’t care what you do. Do anything that’s not work. Play a puzzle. Play a video game. You know, if you can pull yourself out of social media well enough, like if you have the discipline, you can do that. But if not, please don’t do it. Don’t. Do you don’t want to, like, wake up an hour later and go, oh, I’m still on, you know, Instagram or Facebook. But it’s like, take a walk, grab a cup of coffee with a coworker, like, climb the stairs, get some water, do anything. I will go ahead and just share that I’m working right now with a very special partner to create a, I’ll just say, a tool that will hopefully come out in time for Black Friday that will help people know what to do with their work. So fingers crossed. Yeah. Teaser.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:11:51] Okay. Yeah. Because I think I hear that. And I’m like, well, that sounds great in theory. But I also know, like how much I get sucked into what I’m doing or like, I got pulled over and I’m about to step away and an email comes in and I’m like, you, should I just reply to that? You know, because it’s not going to take me that long to reply to this, but it’s that, you know, it just stops you from your momentum of like, okay, I’m going to take break, a micro break and and then all of a sudden I’m not, you know.
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:12:21] So. Right. Exactly. Yeah. And that’s just a great like right there self awareness. Right. So it’s like oh maybe I just turn off the notifications so that I can be more intentional about when I check this, or I don’t let it distract me from what I was going to do. And some people can do that. Some people can’t. So again, like that’s where it’s really great to have personalized coaching because you can get away from these like general heuristics and, and figure out a plan that actually works for your your real world.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:12:50] Yeah. Well, let’s talk more about distractions because I think everyone can agree. You know, your daily life is filled with distractions. You know, there’s constant pinging on your phone email, as I said, you know, things on your computer, you know, that random thoughts, that’s like, oh, yeah, I can’t forget to do this thing. So what are some ways that we can remove the background noise from our everyday lives?
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:13:14] It’s a really important consideration because we don’t really. And I didn’t really even realize the depths to which just the constant cacophony that, like, is actually around us. Until I come across this one article and. And then I went, like, crazy nerd scholar deep into all the ways that all of this noise is affecting us. And maybe made a little too long of a blog post, but about this. But so two parts, like with the distractions itself, right? Can you put your phone on Do Not Disturb for at least a period of time? Right? Can you set up and your day at least two hours of just focused work? And sometimes that’s like that’s easier for a solopreneur to do, for example, than than a manager. But sometimes it’s not. Sometimes it’s easier for the manager than, you know, the business owner that feels like they’re juggling everything. So just really look at your day and see, okay. When do I do my best work? Like, when am I most energized and focused? Okay, that’s the time. Ideally, you’re going to dedicate to focused work the rest of the time. You just start there, and the rest of the time, you know, let it be what it’s going to be because it’s hard to make all of these shifts at one. So if you can just start there, carve out some focused work time, and then like take the next step, which would be okay, when else can I dial down the notifications? Do I need to be immediately interrupted every time somebody likes my post on social media or, you know, texts me something, right? Like went, who do I need to be immediately responsible to? And who do I not? And the phone, you know, especially I know the iPhone. I don’t know Android, but iPhone, you know, has a number of tools now where you can say do not disturb working time. So you only allow these people to break through. You only allow family to break through. You know, I’m driving. So just kind of take a minute to see the tools that you have available and it really will. Like you will buy back your time and then some. And then I can go into kind of the cough, cough, any environmental noise if you want to.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:15:12] No, I want to hear more about that.
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:15:13] And so it was it was really interesting. Basically we are never in quiet. Almost never in quiet. Because there is. Appliances and the just the traffic and the well. I have to have the TV on to work or I have to have the music on work. And look, I’m not judging that. I’m just making examples, right? Like the leaf blowers. As an aside, in case anyone’s listening that works on these things, like how can we put like people into space, but we can’t make a quiet leaf blower? I don’t understand, but just you have these tools and just all of these things, and it it creates this. It raises your stress level baseline is what the research has shown. And so you’re just walking around with this. Like instead of being at zero, you’re already at like I’m making this up like you’re already at like say 20. And then you have the just the other compounding stress of the traffic and the coffeemaker and like the, the microwave beeping and the, the dryer and washer now singing songs when they’re done. I mean, it’s just all the time. So if you, if you can not that I dealt with that personally or anything. But if you can just take a minute and be aware of all of the little pings coming at you. Some may not bother you. But you know, a fish is the last to know it’s in water. So you may not even realize that they’re bothering you until you really kind of pause and listen, right? And then just notice, like, okay, how are those making me feel? And when can you use like quieter appliances or enhance room installation with like the rug or, you know, better windows or noise canceling headphones and just manage again those devices, turning down the volume. Like you can make it a game. Like, how well could I listen to the television and actually still hear it? Many people just, you know, put on to take the time, right? Yeah, yeah. But just give yourself a little bit of quiet time every now and then, like your ears will thank you. The rest of you will. Thank you. It’s really interesting the degree to which this kind of creates a ripple effect for your mental and physical health. Just be by raising that that stress baseline.
David B. Armstrong, CFA [00:17:42] You know, I think it’s common for high achievers to feel guilty when they’re doing something for themselves rather than working. So how can high achievers overcome that sort of guilt and maybe reshape their mindset to prioritize their well-being, while also being able to achieve their professional ambitions?
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:18:03] This is one of the biggest fears, I think, that some folks have when we start talking about maybe working together, made or they hear what I do. And. I think that they’re afraid. And I’ve used this joke so many times I might need to find a new one, but I think they’re afraid that I’m going to say, well, oh, the only way to escape the risk of burnout is to quit the world and move into a year like in Mongolia. And that’s not the case, right? Like, I’m not saying, you know, Jessica, in your introduction, you gave a beautiful example, like, how can we still achieve our personal professional goals, but just do it in a way that lets us keep showing up for the next ten years, right? No one does their work, whether it’s own a business or get that job to just bottom out in a year or five years, you know, work gives us a sense of fulfillment, right? A sense of pride. I think every.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:18:55] Purpose.
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:18:56] I really believe every person like wants to do their best work. It’s just creating those conditions to thrive, to do it, whether it’s the organization or the individual setting themselves up for that. And so coming from that place, Dave, it’s. Again, reframing like if if the word self-care just feels like lame or indulgent or whatever to you. Think of it as again, that performance recovery rate. Rewrite it in your mind. Self-care has gotten this rap now to be like bubble baths and candles and face masks. And I love those, don’t get me wrong. But those aren’t going to cure your burnout like a bullet journal is not going to do it. It’s the boundaries you set for yourself so that you have the time to do those things right. It’s you getting enough sleep so you can you better so you can be more effective and efficient. And you’re thinking and you’re doing and you’re resourcefulness. Like those are the things. And so. Just by telling yourself, well, if I want to show up in my version of the desk Olympics, I’m on the Olympics analogies because, you know, it’s the Olympics. Yeah. But that’s like, that’s our professional sport, right? Like that’s it. That’s what we do. That’s where we excel. If you want to excel, you have to do what you need to do to recover. I was coaching, I used to coach, like CrossFit and lifting and all of that, and. I heard a coach that was training me say that there’s no such thing as over training. There’s only under recovery. And I still go back to that because I think that that’s really true. We know we do so many sports analogies for business, so why not one more like you have to at least recover. In a way that matches the effort you put in. You know, for your mind and your body. And so stretching it out like giving your brain a break. Giving your ears a break. Just taking a breath. Getting into nature. I really. You know, one of my, my high achievers here that they can think of it that way. They do feel less guilty. It does help them make peace with that term self-care a little bit better.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:21:14] Yeah. Just building off of what you’re saying. It’s it’s making me think about how women in particular are very used to kind of doing so much for everyone else. And there’s a phrase that I heard recently from someone that really resonated with me. It was, you don’t have to put yourself first, but don’t put yourself last. Yeah, that really stuck out to me because as. As a mindset of like, okay, it is okay for me to take care of my children and to worry about the laundry and, and the house, in addition to all of my goals and professional things that I like to do. But it is also okay to, just go lay outside in the screened in porch for five minutes, as you said, a micro break, or like something about just like stopping moving my body lately I’ve found, is just like just resting my body. Rather than being in this constant state of movement of, like, I’m going from one thing to the next to the next, which is like a manifestation of how like my brain is working, right? My brain is thinking from one thing to the next to the next. I just found that really helpful, framing that it’s okay to kind of still operate that way because yes, things need to get done, but don’t be constantly putting yourself last.
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:22:30] Yeah, I wrote something similar for the National Association of Women Business Owners that was like just three tips for business owners. Like give yourself. Like, I used to get really frustrated when I heard people say, you know, do this insert self-care action so that you can take care of everyone else better. And I was like, why are we giving that message? Do it because you just you’re a human being and deserve it. Like you don’t have to earn it or justify it. But then, you know, to practice what I preach and be a little more compassionate. I was like, well, that’s meeting some people where they’re at. Like, yes, we would love for the end goal to be, I’m doing this because because I should invest in myself. But if you’re not there yet, if it helps you just move an inch forward. Justify it. However, you need to just just do it. And so if it’s okay, I’m not ready to be first, but I’m okay not being last. Great. If the way you get there is to tell yourself I’m doing this so I can better care for my team or my kids or my partner. Great. As long as you’re doing it. And then maybe we can build up to that self-compassion and that self-worth of I’m doing it because I deserve it. Right.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:23:47] Yeah. Can you I mean is there anything more that you can share about how that self-care and self-compassion help to fight burnout and maintain a lifestyle that’s as we’re talking about both productive and healthy?
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:24:00] Yeah. Well and I’ll just I’ll start with kind of a personal like. I remember the exact moment when I. And I mean I’ve, so that goes without saying. I’ve kind of re directed this, but when I first like quote, learned that not being in constant doing mode was bad. Like I remember that exact moment. And it was decades that I was just constantly like, everything had to have a purpose and everything had to have a reason. And like my hobbies, I turned them into second jobs and like side things before we had side things, you know, like everything was justified. I don’t know, like, I mean, I went to sleep each night, but like, other than that, like, I don’t know that I was just ever. Okay. Being. Like I had to be doing things when watching the TV. You know what I mean? Like you’re just constantly, like you said, just like. A buzz and. It was really hard to stop that. And I still struggle with that sometimes. Right. And I have to catch myself. And part of kind of not just noticing that, but then like stopping yourself and pulling back is, you know, to your question that. That self-awareness, that self-compassion, the education right of like my worth is not measured by my productivity list, right? My my my done it list doesn’t measure how great I am of a person like when I die, which is hopefully a very long time from now. No one’s going to say she was so productive. She was the most productive person, right? Like, I really hope that that’s not what they say. I hope they say things like, she showed up when we needed her. She was compassionate, you know, she was a great friend. She was a great spouse. Like, you know, all of those things that we know we actually really care about the most. But we forget because we think we’re supposed to be so busy and like, life should look like a Pinterest post and it should always look this good and. I don’t know if you guys have ever, like, sewed like, or anything. My mom loves to do it. And so she. When I was a kid, I went to, like, sewing lessons a couple of times. That didn’t last long, but I still remember, like, my mom telling me that when she was learning, I think it was her grandmother, or great aunt or somebody would look at. She would be like, look, I’m done with this and the front will be beautiful. But the back. Yeah. Underside. The stitching was like a hot mess. It was like crossed and too knotted and like. And she was like it doesn’t matter. Like look how pretty it is on the front. Yeah. And whoever that person was with like tear it out. And make her do it again, because the front and the back both needed to look good. And sometimes I think about that with us. Right. It’s like the the Bad Moms movies, right? Like we think everything has to like, as long as it looks good on the outside, like, who cares what kind of show it is behind the scenes, you know? Right. And I think if we could just give ourselves the grace, like, it’s okay to be a little bit of a mess or to, like, not do everything, not say yes to everything, like some things are going to take slower or longer than you want them to. But that’s just life, you know? Stop apologizing for the house looking lived in like you live in it. It’s a house like it’s okay, you know.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:27:41] Like I love the phrase, I heard it, I heard this recently of like, welcome to my house. We live here.
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:27:45] Like it’s like. Yeah, exactly. And I’m saying this is someone who loves the staged home look, right? So like, I have to chill out to, like, I don’t do this because I’m perfect. I do it because, like, I’ve lived it. I’ve been there. I’ve at the very bottom of burnout. I had a couple of different careers because of it. And, you know, I just. My thing is, is that when I first went through burnout, people, I mean, scholars were looking at it. But like people like this, this buzz around it wasn’t there. I had no idea that that’s what it was. It was only when I started doing this work, like later, like I’m like 20 years or whatever later that I was like looking back, going, oh. I just burnt out. But instead it was like working with a bazillion different experts. Not literally obviously, but like for each little thing like, quote symptom of burnout. Because I was treating the symptoms. Because none of us knew that, like what the true cause was, you know. And so that’s something that I really want to help people like, be that resource so people don’t feel like they have to take 20 years to recover from this, or they can never go back to the industry that they wanted to be in because it took so long are so many different, you know, experts that they could no longer afford to get that help. Yeah. You know.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:29:08] Yeah. Or wake up in retirement and be like, what the heck just happened to my life?
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:29:12] Right, right. Or like, I mean, you. Yeah. Where did it go? Right. Was it worth it? Like or you reached the top and you’re like This does not feel like I thought it would. I mean, that’s like, just like the hardest, saddest thing. Like, we don’t want that, you know? So if we can prevent that, that would be we can recover. But it would be so much better to prevent prevent that or not. And, you know, not look back and go, God, I wish I could get that time back.
David B. Armstrong, CFA [00:29:42] Yes. So tell us more about what you do as a burnout coach and maybe a little bit about have, you know, how having a burnout coach can especially help executives and high achievers, like, what are the benefits of having a burnout coach.
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:29:56] So in in just some bullets. Right. So I mentioned to personalized strategies, right? I mean, even just like what we talked about here, you know, I gave some but seem like specific examples. But they’re kind of still general. Right. Like, well, how do I fit sleep into my crazy life, right. Like, how do I fit all of these things in? How do I make them seem doable? You know, I had one client who they were like, okay, I want to start exercising. I was like, great, how many days do you think you want to do that? Well, I should do I should do three and like, well, why do you think you should do three? Because everybody tells you to do Monday, Wednesday, Friday at the gym. Right. And this is not like verbatim, but that’s kind of where we go. I was like, all right. So anyways, we got to kind of setting the goal. They were like. And so I just said like on a scale of 1 to 10, how ready, willing and able do you feel to hit that? And they were like five. And I’m like, okay, so you’re not going to do it right? We had to shrink the goal all the way down to one day a week for five minutes before she felt like a nine, and then giving yourself permission to start there. So it’s that personalized strategy for each goal, right? Helping you create. I like to say we’re helping you create and SOP for your daily life, because if I speak it in business terms, it’s a little more comfortable for most of my clients, right? Like writing you an owner’s manual. And then that accountability. Also, you know, coaches are like a lighthouse. I heard this analogy. I thought it was great, so I kind of adopted it. You know, if you’re as corny as it sounds like the captain of your ship, right? If you’re if you’re out on the water, you know, there’s other boats which are lovely but also annoying. Sometimes there’s, like, rough waters. And then again, like you had a destination in mind when you first started, but then you lost it by trying to navigate all of these changes and interruptions and distractions. And so the lighthouse serves as that just momentary helper. To just clarify the vision, broaden the horizon, help you reorient yourself and figure out where it is that you want to go and the better path to get there. It really can also enhance your leadership skills, because we can look at like, all right, the life skills, how do they transfer to the business and the business acumen? How do you you know, you can take a lot of like your performance, you know, your performance management or your project management tools and verbiage and tactics and apply them to your life. But we just don’t think to do that. And then you know for me I really straddle a few different disciplines. And so you know going to that experience I share like my personal experience. You almost need like that that quarterback right. That person that kind of look at all those aspects of your well-being. And so how can someone help me reframe my stress and also weed out the BS around exercise and nutrition? And also there’s the wheel of life or wellbeing, depending on who you’re kind of asking has different wedges. And I liken it to kind of those Trivial Pursuit game pieces where you needed all the wedges to win the game. It’s kind of like that. Like you want a full wedge for each of these. Social, financial like occupational, like continued personal development. And so how do you just create a plan to, to get all of those wedges. And that’s really where a coach that specializes in this can come into play, because they can work with you on every single one of those wheels or those wedges. In a way that’s just feels actually doable and not overwhelming, because you don’t want a coach that’s supposed to help you prevent or recover from burnout, to cause burnout and just be like, right, do this. Here’s here’s the best practices, right? Like, well, they say 150 minutes of exercise a week or 7 to 9 hours. So like, just do it right. Like it’s just not a place where many people can start, you know? So they just help you meet. They help, they meet you where you’re at. And just then kind of lay out a realistic path to get where you’re going to go.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:34:03] I like that framing that you had earlier about like, what’s the likelihood of you doing this? I’m like trying to get like a nine out of ten likelihood that you’re going to do it. Like I’m like, yeah, that’s a better way than just being more aspirational. Like, I think I could do this now. What are you really actually capable of doing right now?
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:34:19] Right, right. I mean, set your goals for, like, the worst case scenario, you know, like on your busiest day, like, what can you actually do? You know, there’s there’s got to be a blend of soft and tough love. And, you know, that’s the degree to which you go to each is depending on the client. But but yeah, you need someone to also kind of call you out sometimes. Like I don’t really think you’re going to do that.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:34:43] Well, this is great. Thank you. Rachel, I think you’ve given us some really good insights on burnout prevention and actions to fight it. I think I have a better tool set. Now, to understanding kind of what causes burnout and definitely some self-examination to do. I do encourage everyone on Rachel’s got a great blog, that you can sign up for on her website. It’s definitely it’s been it’s been helpful without being overwhelming. I appreciate that, Rachel, that you’re not going to your point about not having a coach saying, constantly saying, do this, do this, do this. So.
Rachel Boehm, NBC-HWC, PhD Candidate [00:35:20] Exactly, you know, I’m so glad thanks and you know where to find me. If you want anything, if you want anything more personalized. But I really appreciate the opportunity just to get the word out. And, you know, it’s really important, it’s important to me to be able to be a resource for people. So thank you.
Jessica Gibbs, CFP® [00:35:33] Yeah, yeah, I think as we talked about today, it’s just it’s just so important to nurture your body and your mind to to banish burnout. And just as a burnout coach can help you master your environment and prevent robots to success. So a wealth advisor can also help you get clear on your goals, for wealth and for living. So don’t wait until burnout hits or a financial setback strikes. Take proactive steps now to get your team of advisors in place to help you design the life that you want to live. So thank you for joining us for this episode of Off the Wall, the podcast, aimed at helping founders, executives and high net worth individuals build wealth with purpose. Please be sure to subscribe and share with a friend, and we look forward to seeing you back here next time.
